OR: The Difference Between Editting and Reporting the News...
Published on August 31, 2004 By CrispE In Politics
I attended a recent showing of "Outfoxed" which was billed by those that I had heard speak of it as a left wing attempt at bashing Rupert Murdoch and Foxnews for right wing bias in editting the news to fit the propoganda mechanism that is the current right wing administration. There were descriptions that included "poor quality filming and camera work" as well as "editting issues" that made the film in part unwatchable. However, the film raises several issues that should be considered regardless of your political persuasion because the issue of news reporting is central in a republic to the decision making process of the people.

Thomas Jefferson (who as President received criticsm quite often, sometimes very undeserved) said that the country was better off with a "free press and not a free government" than vice-versa. What Jefferson meant by a free press was that the media that reports the news should take a critical eye to what government did to ensure that the people were getting both sides of the argument the government would present.

Governments have their own information dissemanation methods including spokespeople to voice their own points of view as well as contacts within the "edittorial community" (the talking heads and pundits who bombard us with their opinions of what the personalities of politics are doing). The news organizations then must take pains to scrutinize the information provided as well as digging nto the issues that face us and present us with all sides.

The history of propoganda in the world is full of examples of when the press does not take on the aspect of presenting the public with a well rounded look at issues. Consider PRAVDA in the old Soviet Union. The purpose of PRAVDA was to tell the people that the Soviet Union was the best place in the world, everything was getting better and better and say problems were temporary and that sooner rather than later everyone would be living the good life. All people needed to do was what the government thought was best for them, not question, and accept that their sacrifice was worthwhile.

Is this the argument Outfoxed makes? It certainly takes Fox, fox reporters and producers and personalities (Bill O'Reilly, Sean Hannity and Brit Hume) to task for multiple occurences of bias in mixing opinion with news until the line between the two are so blurred that the viewer would be hard pressed to tell where one starts and the other ends. But further, it illustrates the connection between making money by all news organizations and content of broadcasts. This includes the major networks as well as CNN.

Many of you might think (as I did at one time) that CNN was the balance to Fox but this is now in question in my own mind because the methods of "spinning" that Fox is often accused of are widespread on CNN in an attempt to keep advertising dollars that might leave with lower ratings. So, does that mean that the advertisers are really in control of the news media and the ultimate determination of what we see and how we see it?

To answer this you have to ask yourself what the advertisers want you to see. Do they want you to question the government? Is uncertainty in the future to their advantage? Do you buy more stuff when you feel good or unsure?

Personally I think that the smoke and mirrors in the stock market may be the best indication of this. Consider the unemployment rate and the increases we have seen in inflation and unrest and the world and there does seem to be a disconnect between the reality and how the news is portrayed in the media. Questioning by all news sources is muted and we are constantly reminded that the new car, house, and job are just around the corner.

Remind you of anything?


Comments (Page 2)
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on Sep 01, 2004
I watch the O'Reily Factor at least once a week and I read his first book. From my experience watching it, it is a very conservative show. Here are the topics he's gone through...

•Koch: I'm Voting for Bush
-A former Democrat blasts Kerry and the Dems.
•Att. Ginsberg on Swift Resignation
-Former SBV Lawyer comes out and says he told the White House nothing about the ads ahead of time. Neutral for most part, but looks good for Bush because one man says he didn't tell the white house about any of this.
•Swift Boats: Political Distraction or Dynamite?
-The 2 hammer Kerry for not handling the ads better make him seem incompitent.
•American Injustice: 60 Days For Child Rape
-Another ad for why we need more jails and police. Does he ever do any on how people are sent 25-Life for drug use? Or how innocent people are put away?
•Taking Sex Ed Too Far?
-Against sex ed in school, pretty conservative position.
•Iraqi Teen Helps Prevent Terror Attacks
-Call for more military action in another city.
•Abortion and Parental Rights of Notification
-Talking about the issue of parents being notified for a child's abortion., which all 3 quests agree should pass. No case against the bill is given, even by the supposed liberal.
•Does Immigration Increase Gang Activity?
-This issue is what convinces me that the "liberal" media is a myth. Everyday on these programs there is at least one segment on how there are too many Mexicans and they are destroying the country. Their solution is to militarize the neighborhoods and furhter militarize the border. Buchanon does this crap on MSNBC and CNN is following the lead. It's crap like this that makes normal people to expect the worst when they see the "profile" person of color, because these brown bodies are causing harm to their nation, as they are told. The segment doesn't even advocate against illegal immigration, it advocates for more regulation against ALL immigration. This crap gets programmed EVERY DAY in the "liberal" media.
•Red Cross Cleans Up in Charley's Aftermath
-I don't know if this is conservative or not, but it does play to the fear angle. In this case it's mother nature. One dude actually says "This is a very, very scary thing." THE APOCALYPSE IS COMING!!! :::break for commercial::: Lease a Jaguar for Zero Down and no payments till March!!! Hurray on down!!!
•Alec Baldwin: My Life Is Nobody's Business
-O'Reilly attacks Hollywood lefties and even Michael Moore a lil bit.
•What on Earth Is Happening in New Jersey?
-He actually defends the Gov., but makes an accusation that Jersey is really "Tony Saprano Land". The old unions involved with the mob ploy.
Mah, see!
•Is the Minority Media Majorly Biased?
-Has he ever had a segment on how the white media is biased? He's pretty much questioning why blacks are biased against Bush.
•Group Cries Foul on Border Control Measure
-What a shock. Another topic about the border. He spins this issue more than any other.
•Vietnam Vet Says Kerry Saved His Life
-He defends the SBV by saying they can both be right. How can they both be right if they disagree?

Almost all these topics he's gone threw are conservative in nature. He also does not say it is merely an opinion show, he says he brings out the truth with no spin. He says he brings you the topics concerning the country fairly, which he clearly stated when talking about the coverage of the Iraqi war. He's even given the President a free pass by saying he didn't lie about the WMD's in Iraq since he didn't know. That may work for Pre-School, but not the President.
on Sep 01, 2004
He's even given the President a free pass by saying he didn't lie about the WMD's in Iraq since he didn't know. That may work for Pre-School, but not the President.


Parroting Mikey. And weak.

Otherwise, you see O'Reilly correctly - he makes no bones about his conservatism. Call it spin-stopping truth-detecting, yada yada, but the fact is the points of view he brings to his show were not getting any airtime before the cable news revolution and Fox News. That was my point.

Cheers,
Daiwa
on Sep 01, 2004
Daiwa:

You are either missing the point I'm trying to make or confusing it with bias. I don't care about bias. If a stockbroker talks about a stock for example, they have to say "I own the stock or am short the stock" but news networks like FoxNEWS don't have to do anything of the kind. When the line between news and opinion blurs AND sells products then other networks adopt the policy and we become a nation that is buying products with our news (opinion) and not a news broadcast supported by advertisers.

Advertisers NEVER want you to think there is anything bad going on in the world and so they support the military, the status quo of conservative government and the concept that you the consumer should only worry about your next new car, house, dustmop, etc. That's the threat we are really facing. That threat is real, now, and very dangerous.
on Sep 01, 2004

JDJefferson:

Sorry I find it just so amusing that someone who

a) argue that the news has a conservative bias (including NPR)

Use "facts" from a left wing media watchdog group who thinks EVERYTHING has a conservative spin to it to "prove it"

c) When asked if he even watches these shows to make his own determination says "You should go out more, read a book, blah blah blah".  Well, I have to watch these shows for research for a project that I was recently involved on.

And what I can tell you is that NONE of them have a significant partisan approach to their news.  FOXNews is no more GOP TV than PBS is DEM TV.  They all have their own tone and some of them have more conservative or liberal commentators than others but none of them are overtly partisan (none enough to justify something as profoundly manipulated as Out Foxed). 

What I suggest is to actually -think for yourself-. Every time I ask for specifics, I get nothing.  The best I've seen in the year of debates on this kind of thing is CrispE making vague assertions that the morning news is pro-Bush (which I don't agree with as during the Democratic convention they were pretty glowing about some of the Democratic speeches).

Consider the Fox News panel.  It includes 1 person from the Washington Post, 2 people from NPR, 2 people from the Weekly Standard. One from "Roll Call" (moderate). And Brit Hume (conservative).  So you've got 2 right-wingers, 1 moderate right, 2 moderates, and 2 liberals.  So that's a slight right of center panel. And that's the kind of thing that the left-wingers on the net freak out about.

But on the other hand, This Week on Sunday ABC is hosted by George Stephanaplous -- Clinton's former press secretary. And their panel was more left than right (with the token George Will as the conservative).

On CNN, The Capital Gang is decidedly left wing.

HardBall with Chris Mathews tillts a bit to the left but other shows on MSNBC tilt a bit to the right.

My point is that NONE of these places are particularly left wing or right wing. They may tilt a bit one way or the other but nothing that substantial. Not enough for intelligent people to not be able to filter out the bias.

on Sep 01, 2004
Rat - O'Reilly is a fiscal conservative and traditionalist. But he's liberal on quite a number of issues. 
on Sep 01, 2004
"But he's liberal on quite a number of issues. "


If you watch his show you'll find he gets belligerant email from ultra-conservatives accusing him of being Liberal and even being pro-Kerry. The problem is some people have lost all reasonable understanding of what "middle" is in the US. You are either left of center or evil.
on Sep 01, 2004
Draginol:

It's not a vague assertion the morning crew is right wing. It is my opinion from years of watching. They cloud the line between news and opinion as much as O'Reilly and Hannity. But the point isn't the lean of the bias, it's the division between news reports selectively chosen and reported with bias versus the idea that news is entertainment rather than information reported. Do you agree that Foxnews's "Fair and Balanced" banner should be dropped?

I mean, there is much to hear and learn on Joeuser, but you don't suggest it is a "news sight" do you?
on Sep 01, 2004

CrispE: The morning shows on FoxNews are along the lines of the morning shows on other networks - they're not hard news. Do you think Katie Couric isn't pretty far left-wing for instance?

The hard news, as in the actual lady at a desk reporting the news on Fox is just as hard news as anywhere else.

on Sep 01, 2004
Draginol-

Sorry I find it just so amusing that someone who
a) argue that the news has a conservative bias (including NPR)
Use "facts" from a left wing media watchdog group who thinks EVERYTHING has a conservative spin to it to "prove it"


Facts are facts whether they come from the left or the right.

I am only making a reference to your suggestion that NPR is a "liberal" media. I have no comment on FoxNews or the others, as I don't have a TV and cannot say for myself whether any of those networks have any bias. Personally, all I know is BBC (radio), DemocracyNow! (radio), and NPR, as well as my local newspaper--of which I am fortunate to have two choices each day: The Wisconsin State Journal (on the right), and The Capitol (Madison) Times (on the left). I think BBC, because of their international base, has a more liberal bias, DemocracyNow! is definitely farther to the left (though if you ever heard Amy Goodman's [the host] interview with Bill Clinton in 2000, she ripped him a new one!), but is not afraid to attack the left when it deserves it, and NPR is pretty middle-of-the-road.
A show like DemocracyNow! can behave as it pleases and report to the left or right at will because it is not beholden to corporate sponsors. That, you must admit draginol, is where the real problem is with network news. If a network news program is "liberal" or "right-wing" it is so because of ratings and corporate influence. Just look at CBS backing down from showing the Ronald Reagan movie a few months back. Whether the movie was factually correct or a blend of fact and fiction, Viacom made sure it didn't air. It's the same reason call-in talk shows are so biased one way or the other--ratings. Ratings attract advertisers.
Fox can be as pro-right as it likes. Rush can spew for hours at a time for all I care. In the end, however, it is up the viewer (or listener, or reader) to ask themselves if there is another side of a story. Sadly, I don't think many do.
I'm not against you Draginol, I just wanted to make a point that there are other sides to an issue. Keep raising the issues and fighting the good fight, but play nice.
Thank you.
on Sep 01, 2004
Do you agree that Foxnews's "Fair and Balanced" banner should be dropped?


You mean much in the same way Bill O'Reilly has a "No-Spin Zone".

CrispE, let's swing this back towards the original point of the article about conflicted interests. In your industry, the people you need to watch to make your analyses have at least a small vested interest in the advice they are giving you, as they may work at firms that are making profits on the very stocks they recommend or discuss. Is it unethical? Yes, of course it is. Does it stop the network from hiring them. No... because that would be bad business... you need to have someone that has experience or the illusion of experience in the field they discuss for you to have any credibility... even if that conflicts with the perception of their integrity.
on Sep 01, 2004

Facts are facts whether they come from the left or the right.

Do you know the difference between a fact an opinion? There are entire books available pointing out the left-wing bias on these same networks. How can that be?

You are confusing subjective analysis with facts.

 

on Sep 01, 2004
Just look at CBS backing down from showing the Ronald Reagan movie a few months back. Whether the movie was factually correct or a blend of fact and fiction, Viacom made sure it didn't air. It's the same reason call-in talk shows are so biased one way or the other--ratings. Ratings attract advertisers


I think the whole reason for that was that the Reagan family did not approve of the movie, or were not asked for permission before hand to do that movie, so therefore if they showed it the Reagan family could have sued them for not getting their permission. Would be the same result if ABC, NBC, etc. wanted to do a movie about Me, and didn't ask me, do you think I want them airing a movie about myself without my prior consent, or at least for a monetary reason, without getting paid for my story?
on Sep 01, 2004
Draginol:

So...no comment on "Fair and Balanced"? If they aren't biased or simply filling time between the important commercials, you shouldn't have any trouble responding.

You seem to be stating that a variety of biases in the media makes the situation ok. I think that is how we get ourselves ever deeper into problems. The longer we allow news and opinion to be blurred the more likely news organizations will be biased towards the status quo and the harder it will be for the people to make informed choices.
on Sep 01, 2004
Do you know the difference between a fact an opinion? There are entire books available pointing out the left-wing bias on these same networks. How can that be?
You are confusing subjective analysis with facts


Draginol: By facts, I assume you mean objective data? Objective measurements of the investigator.
From the FAIR website: "FAIR’s study recorded every on-air source quoted in June 2003 on four National Public Radio news shows: All Things Considered, Morning Edition, Weekend Edition Saturday and Week-end Edition Sunday. Each source was classified by occupation, gender, nationality and partisan affiliation. Altogether, the study counted 2,334 quoted sources, featured in 804 stories."
So when FAIR listened to NPR they recorded each guest/pundit/commentator/think tank/correspondent, etc. that spoke on air. Wouldn't this qualify as a fact?
I agree that there is one element to this research that involves subjectivity, and that is the classification of partisan affiliation. Some are going to be easy to classify as Republican or Democrat (like someone from The National Review, or WSJ [on the right], or somebody from Mother Jones or MoveOn.org [on the left]). Others will involve some subjectivity to determine which side of the fence they're on.
We can say: Joe Smith was on NPR. Fact. Joe Smith is a Republican. This may be a hard fact (e.g. he may be a registered Republican) or it could involve some subjective analysis (e.g. he recently gave a speech criticizing labor unions).
I think you're being overly critical of FAIR as favoring left-wing media. Yes they have been critical of Fox and WSJ, but they've also directed criticism toward Pacifica Radio and PBS--and NPR.
So if NPR is liberal, as you suggest, and FAIR is a left-wing group, then why would FAIR bother to investigate NPR?
I can't emphasize enough, Draginol, that I'm not trying to antagonize you.

I think the whole reason for that was that the Reagan family did not approve of the movie, or were not asked for permission before hand to do that movie, so therefore if they showed it the Reagan family could have sued them for not getting their permission. Would be the same result if ABC, NBC, etc. wanted to do a movie about Me, and didn't ask me, do you think I want them airing a movie about myself without my prior consent, or at least for a monetary reason, without getting paid for my story?


ShoZan-- I agree that the reason put forth for the cancellation of this movie was the issue of consent. I am not fully convinced that this is the whole story--I may be wrong, as I have been in the past. Networks do air those hokey "unauthorized" biographies all the time. I'm not sure but was the Michael Jackson bio approved? Or any of the other countless celebrity bios? Just guessing, as I don't know for sure.

Sorry, I realize that I am guilty of hijacking this forum and taking it off topic!
Thanks.
on Sep 01, 2004
I think the fact that Reagan was being played by Mr. Barbara Steisand, James Brolin, had a lot to do with it too.
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